Er denne US M1 foldkolbe original ??

[Ped]

Er på jagt efter en original US M1 foldekolbe, så den her på gul og gratis.

http://www.guloggratis.dk/samlerobjekte ... us-carbine

Jeg mener at den er falsk da nitterne er flade og malet over, nummeret i metal kolben kappen er alt for dybe samt historien vedr. RAF mærkningen.
Skæftet er lakeret.

Er i enige /uenige ?

[Overtroldmand]

Er på jagt efter en original US M1 foldekolbe, så den her på gul og gratis.

http://www.guloggratis.dk/samlerobjekte ... us-carbine

Jeg mener at den er falsk da nitterne er flade og malet over, nummeret i metal kolben kappen er alt for dybe samt historien vedr. RAF mærkningen.
Skæftet er lakeret.

Er i enige /uenige ?

De ligner ikke org.
http://parallaxscurioandrelicfirearmsfo ... eeded-ASAP

Burde se sådanne ud:
http://www.gunauction.com/buy/5789936

og så er der også 'fake' nitter..
http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=103264


All M1A1 carbines were procured through Inland (meaning originally all actions were of Inland manufacture). Carbine actions assembled in M1A1 configuration were absolutely the same as their M1 counterpart of the same production period, and there is no M1A1 serial number record available. According to the best available sources, about 71,000 were produced from November 1942 to October 1943, and about 69,000 from May to December 1944, for a total of about 140,000 M1A1 carbines.

However, the number of M1A1 stocks produced during WWII was much higher than complete carbines turned out by Inland, and totals about 240,000, which puts at around 100,000 the number of “spare” M1A1 complete stocks available to Uncle Sam (pistol grips were also produced as spares in high numbers).

The stock wood was made for Inland by the S.E. Overton Company, and the metal hardware for the stock was assembled by the Royal Typewriters, Inc. (which was also responsible for the whole stock assembly, but actually dropped the ball to Overton in 1944). Starting in early 1944, Overton subcontracted about 178,000 pistol grips to the Richardson Furniture Company, which also produced 8,000 more pistol grips for Springfield Armory at the end of 1944. The Springfield Armory directly produced about 7,300 M1A1 stocks in 1945-1946.

Because of this surplus of M1A1 stocks and spare parts, not all M1A1 carbines delivered in the second half of the war (starting in May 1944) had stocks incorporating the latest modifications (notably, the so called “low wood” uncovering the operating slide handle, which was adopted on conventional M1 stocks at the end of 1943 - beginning of 1944). On the other hand, these 1944 onward M1A1 stocks were often characterized by a different, more concave shape of the pistol grip, and it is quite possible, judging from observed specimen, this corresponds to the subcontracting of grips by Overton to the Richardson company. Stocks made by Springfield Armory in 1945-46 were all of the “low wood” type, and used this same style of grips.

No M1A1 stock produced during WWII was adapted to selective fire (M2 type), and we have no data on postwar production of M1A1 stocks (if 100,000 spare were available, it is unlikely this took place). However, it is reported selective fire M2 carbines were used in the folding stock configuration by the US Special Forces in the early part of the Vietnam war, so at least some bona-fide M1A1 stocks were modified by the US Army to that end. The same might have happened in Korea earlier on.

Finally, I have reasons to believe M1A1 wood stocks were procured by the Terni Army Arsenal during the 1950’s – early 1960’s, possibly as replacement parts for broken US-made stocks used by the Italian armed forces.

From the above follows:

A 1) original M1A1 stocks from 1942-1943 Inland production (or spares thereof) will be of the “high wood” type, will have the “thick” type of pistol grip, and will be marked OI (for Overton Inland) inside the stock channel (near the reinforcing bridge in front of the opening for the trigger housing) and on the bottom of the pistol grip. If the stock came off a complete carbine, it will also be marked with the Ordnance crossed cannons on the bottom of the pistol grip, and will very often, but not always, bear a circled or uncircled “P” on the back of the stock (applied at proof firing). If the stock was a spare, and was not used in overhauling, it will not be stamped with the Ordnance acceptance mark and “P”.

A 2) same as above, but overhauled; the stock will bear Arsenal overhaul markings (such as AA for the Augusta Arsenal, etc.) usually on its left side near the rear of the receiver, and it will have been modified to “low wood” configuration. Sometimes a new uncircled “P” was applied at overhaul, usually on the pistol grip.

B 1) original M1A1 stocks from the second procurement period (May 1944 onward) will either be the same as A 1) above, or (mostly) the pistol grip will be marked RI above a smaller 3 (identifying subcontracted pistol grip production by the Richardson Forniture Co). Also, while the first of these 1944 produced stocks were of the “high wood” type, later on they left the Overton factory in “low wood” configuration, but the changeover date is unsure.

B 2) overhauled B 1; the same notations apply as per A 1

C 1) original M1A1 stocks produced by Springfield Armory in 1945-46 were all of the “low wood” type. They should be marked SA on the stock (at least, this is true for postwar M2 stocks produced at the Armory) but I have not yet observed this on original M1A1 stocks. On the other hand, the SA marking is frequently found under M1A1 pistol grips. Either Richardson sent unmarked grips to Springfield in 1944, or the SA marked grips are postwar replacements.

C 2) overhauled C 1; same notes as for A 2 and B 2.

D 1) any of the above modified for selective fire during the 1960’s (and possibly 1950’s for Korea).

E 1) Italian postwar military M1A1 stocks (as opposed to commercial copies). Based on surviving specimen, I think M1A1 wood stocks were produced in Italy after the war. Thease examined stocks are often (but not always) marked with typical Terni Arsenal stock inspection markings (small ovals with letters / symbols inside). Sometimes these markings are hidden under the recoil plate, sometimes they are visible on the sides of the stock near the recoil plate cap. Also, the rear of these (possibly Italian) stocks is much more square in profile than those produced by Overton or by Springflied Armory (which I think were already a little more square at the back than the Overton ones). Finally, it is noteworthy these "Italian" stocks are of the old, "high wood" type. So they may be mistaken for (or represented as) early WWII US-made stocks.

This goes for wood, what about the metal parts?

All original US Army stock extensions were parkerized (not blued), the metal tubing was heavily soldered (not brazed) to the end parts which mate with the recoil plate and lower hinge assembly, and the leather fitting was very accurate. Rivets were always flush with the leather, and may be blackened brass or parkerized steel, both tubular or (reportedly, I have no direct experience with that) plain type. Some authors presume brass was used on earlier stocks, but since brass was classified as a critical material only for a couple of years at mid-war, that's not a sure fact, I think. Finally, original buttplates are cast, not stamped, steel, and will have a cast-in drawing and manufacturing die cavity number, separated by a circled asterisk, e.g. B257614 (asterisk) 3 (numbers from 1 to 12 observed). These inscriptions are sometimes very shallow, to the point of being illegible.

Metal stock extensions mated to what I hypothesize are Italian postwar military stocks are undistinguishable from their US counterpart, and in fact may well be of US manufacture. However, some of these exhibit refurbishing, in which case the newly installed rivets sometimes show a less even press fitting.

Commercial copies are usually easy to identify, because they will have different characteristics than those listed above. Even if fake markings are applied to the wood, the metal stock will usually give them away, either because of finish, craftsmanship, or the quality of the leather and rivets. Also, the drawing number on the buttplate, if at all present, is usually stamped, not cast-in. Of course, a con artist may produce a very good look-alike.
Reproductions are usually less sturdy than originals. Sometimes, the recoil plates on repro stocks break upon the first firing. Several types of repros have surfaced over the years, and at least those from the 1980’s were made in Italy. As far as I know, repro M1A1 stocks are currently available through many sources, notably Sarco in the USA, and Auto Ordnance has started producing (or marketing) them in 2008 for their new M1A1 carbines.

[Bertelsen]

Har sådan et skæfte liggende.
Prøver lige at se om jeg kan få taget nogle ordentlige billeder af Det, i
Løbet af i morgen.


Mvh.

Bertelsen

[Truffel]

jeg vil nok sige at den er uoriginal
et remmen er forkert, ende beslaget er ww2 men 8tals jernet er post ww2
desuden så er læderet brunt i stedet for mørkt
synd for sælger som tror han har en guldgrube der, mere synd for den som køber det som originalt

[Bertelsen]

Så var der lidt billeder af mit skæfte





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[Overtroldmand]

Hvis man googler lidt rundt, så kan man godt se at de åbenbart bliver sat sammen fra en masse dele, er det hele repro?